Most leaders genuinely want to matter to the people around them. But they operate in a culture that turns everything into a transaction: work, friendship, meaning. Last year, Simon Sinek took the stage at Amsterdam Business Forum. This year, it is Seth Godin's turn. The longtime friends sat down for an episode of Sinek's podcast A Bit of Optimism. The conversation produced three lessons every leader needs to hear.
"If you're not going to do it with love, then what's the point? It's not a hustle, it's your life."
Seth Godin has written 21 bestselling books, translated into 40 languages. He is widely credited as the inventor of permission marketing and was inducted into the Marketing Hall of Fame. In the words of Simon Sinek: "Seth is a prolific author and a marketing genius who knows firsthand how love can take an interaction from transactional to transformational."
The full conversation is worth your time:
A bit of optimism: Down a Rabit Hole with Seth Godin
No time to listen right now? Here are 3 insights to get you started:
Seth draws a sharp distinction: doing something for someone you like or respect is one thing. Doing something with love is a different category altogether. That kind of love costs time and energy. And because they are limited, they matter more than money.
He illustrates it with a story. Simon Sinek once told him about a Thanksgiving dinner that had gone completely wrong. An amateur cook who stirred foie gras into the stuffing, spooned caviar over everything, and made every single dish so rich and overdone it was inedible. Months later, on an ordinary weeknight, Seth made Simon a full, traditional Thanksgiving dinner. Godin is a vegetarian. He barely ate any of it himself.
"If the giver gets more joy from the effort than the receiver gets from the gift," says Seth, "that's the test of love."
Ask yourself: when did you last do something for someone that genuinely cost you and not because it was the smart move?
Seth learned early on to get comfortable with failure. Not as a byproduct of setbacks, but as a deliberate choice he made at the age of twelve. Years later, he even had T-shirts printed for the people who spent time in his office. Each shirt showed Humpty Dumpty alongside the words: This might not work. Many people struggled to wear them. Not because of how they looked, but because those four words alone made them uncomfortable.
Failure feels personal. Like a verdict on who you are rather than something that simply did not go according to plan. But saying "this might not work" removes that pressure. Simon adds that it turns an idea into a shared adventure. "This might not work. Let's do it anyway" invites people to think alongside you. "I think we should do this" forces them to judge you.
Add "this might not work" to your next proposal and notice what shifts in the room.
Most leaders say yes because they are afraid of disappointing someone. Seth flips that: "It's the yeses that get you into trouble. Every yes borrows from tomorrow."
He illustrates it with a mentor from early in his career, someone who promised four times to introduce him to the right people once Seth left his job. Four times. When the moment came: nothing. The man had never meant it. He needed to make the promise to feel good in the moment, at a point when it cost him nothing. Seth recognizes this pattern everywhere: leaders who over-promise and fail to deliver, convincing themselves they are there for everyone while disappointing everyone.
No is not a rejection. No is honesty. And honesty is the foundation of any real trust.
Take stock of the commitments you cannot keep. And be honest about them.
The thread running through Seth and Simon's conversation is straightforward: the things that truly matter cannot be automated, delegated, or optimized. Not the Thanksgiving dinner, not the willingness to fail, not the honest no. They cost something. And that is precisely what makes them count.
Learn from Seth Godin live
Seth Godin is one of the headline speakers at Amsterdam Business Forum 2026. So if you want to understand what leading with love looks like in practice and what it demands of you as a leader, Friday, September 18, is your chance to hear him live.